The federal government’s proposed Alto high-speed rail project was the final topic of the Sunday, April 12 episode of Cross-Country Checkup on CBC Radio.
Host Ian Hanomansing was joined by guests Michael Schabas, a rail transportation consultant, and University of Toronto Professor of Geography and Planning Matti Siemiatycki, who is also Director of the Infrastructure Institute at the university. They discussed the estimated $60 to $90 billion project, its risks, and benefits.
Siemiatycki emphasized that no route has yet been selected, but that a more northerly route is likely.
Chavez said it is possible for Alto to find creative solutions to problems by looking at lessons learned from high-speed rail projects in other countries.
“They just have to come around to discover it,” he said.
Chavez said the entire line connecting Toronto to Ottawa, Montréal, and Québec City is unlikely to be completed for 20 years. He said much of the construction will be easy because tunnels will not be required, except for entry and exit from Montréal because the city is located on an island.
Hanomansing said federal Minister of Transport Steven MacKinnon had been invited to appear on the program but was not available. Instead, audio from a recent interview MacKinnon gave to CTV saying the Conservative Party previously supported high-speed rail was played for listeners.
Conservative Leader Pierre Poilievre is opposed to Alto and has said he would cancel the Liberal government’s project if he were Prime Minister.
Schabas said high-speed rail is financially viable.
“The secret about high-speed rail is it actually makes money,” he remarked, and even projected an operating surplus for the service.
“I think we’re being over-ambitious,” said Siemiatycki. He referred to a McGill University Study which alleges it would take 40 to 50 years before any profit is realized.
“There’s still big questions about how many riders are actually going to use this system,” Siemiatycki said.
Chavez said that contrary to some opinions, high-speed rail is not meant only for rich people and that it would also have significant environmental benefits.
Siemiatycki said issues like health and defence are more important to Canadians at this time.
Among the callers to the program was Marcus Haefele, a farmer whose property is located between Vankleek Hill and Alfred.
“For the farm as a business, it could have a very detrimental impact,” Haefele said.
On high-speed rail lines, there are no level railroad crossings. Roads and lanes either go over or under the tracks or are blocked off.
“We don’t know where any sort of crossings are going to be built,” Haefele said.
He said it is not as efficient to work small sections of field that become disconnected after being bisected by a rail line. Haefele said he is not looking to gain financially from the project but does not want to see his land severed.
Haefele said he was disappointed with the Alto open house in Vankleek Hill on January 29.
“There was nobody there who was able to answer any questions,” he said.
“I haven’t had anybody get back to me,” Haefele added.
Schabas said Alto’s map has created unnecessary anxiety among property owners. He does not understand why Alto began with an area that includes most of southeastern Ontario.
He noted wider corridors were needed for some major highway projects than what is needed for high-speed rail, and that the number of properties which will be ultimately affected is much smaller than on the current map.
“These types of concerns are really typical of high-speed rail lines,” Siemiatycki said. He added that the concerns are also what can increase the project cost. He said that in Britain, tunnels have had to be built to accommodate bats and farm equipment.
Hanomansing said a survey done by Alto of 3,000 people indicated 69 per cent support for the project.
Siemiatycki said concerns over land expropriation and land can ultimately derail a project or at least delay it. He said the government and Alto need to be much more specific about a plan, which would also reduce some of the concern.
Siemiatycki said existing rail or highway corridors are not straight enough for high-speed lines but would like to see that possibility reexamined or for the focus to instead be on better passenger rail service in existing VIA Rail corridors. He added that originally, the government was proposing to instead make improvements to existing rail service but found it was not ambitious enough.
“I would like to see that reexamined,” Siemiatycki said. He noted the cost of that alternative was projected at just $8 to $12 billion.
Chavez said such a plan is not feasible.
“The high-frequency rail plan VIA came up with, did not work,” said Schabas. He said that in its development, there was no cooperation with either CN or CP for entry into cities and coordination with their freight traffic.
To listen to the complete segment on Alto which aired on the Sunday, April 12 edition of Cross Country Checkup, go to https://www.cbc.ca/radio/checkup.
